Making an Art of the Unknown: An Interview with Clint Sabom on Applying Franz Bardons Works

Today we are joined by Clint Sabom who is the creative director at 'Contemplative Light' He is a long-term practitioner of Franz Bardons teachings, and he shares his experience with us on multiple topics. If you find this or other interviews useful then please do let us know in the comments.

Today we are joined by Clint Sabom who is the creative director at ‘Contemplative Light’ He is a long-term practitioner of Franz Bardons teachings, and he shares his experience with us on multiple topics. If you find this or other interviews useful then please do let us know in the comments.

Update: Clint now has three courses on Perseus Arcane Academy.
1. Free Course – The First Three Steps of Initiation into Hermetics
2. Overcoming The Difficulties In Steps 4,5, & 6: Further Work In ‘Initiation into Hermetics’
3. Emotional Release: The Secret of Success with the Elements


PAA: Welcome to Perseus Arcane Academy and a huge thank you to you for agreeing to take part in this interview. Could you briefly introduce yourself, your spiritual path and how you came to meet with the teachings of Franz Bardon.

Clint: I was always “philosophically oriented” from a young age. But my spiritual life escalated rapidly – too rapidly – at age 21 when I had an organic kundalini awakening during my junior year at Vassar College. I hadn’t encountered mysticism previously but started to read the Tao Te Ching for the first time. The book resonated with me as a current, and I followed the current into my heart chakra, which then deepened into the spine, and the kundalini awoke upwards and downwards from there.

My spiritual frequency surpassed my psychological development to such a degree that it became what Ken Wilber might call a “spiritual emergency.” It took many years to fully integrate the psychological and spiritual, but I was fortunate enough to have the help of many great mentors and light workers. Then around age 30, I went to live at a silent monastery for six months.

There, I read Eckhart Tolle’s The Power of Now, and the book alongside the monastic practices really cleared up my consciousness. After leaving the monastery, it was still several years before I encountered Franz Bardon. I came to him by way of reference from other books I was reading. When I first read Bardon, his theory section resonated with me as true. It wasn’t like I was discovering something new, rather being told more clearly what I already understood intuitively as reality.

Of course, I peaked ahead and read the whole book first out of mad curiosity. But it’s important to mention that the reading of the book was like a spiritual practice. Some of the processes in the steps began to take place in me just from reading the book, and the text had a momentum: it began to work on me immediately like a living being before I even started doing the formal practices of the steps.

PAA: Lets cover some of the standard questions we like to ask Bardon practitioners. 

Vacancy of mind: How should students approach this key exercise and what should they do if they have been struggling with the requirements?

Clint: For me, the most thorough way to achieve it is by reading and practicing The Power of Now. But if that work proves too difficult, I suggest students practice a basic Buddhist breathing meditation, counting the breaths, one to two-hundred. This strengthens the will and clears the mind. There is also the Buddhist concept of emptiness that can be useful. Viewing everything with no inherent form but always changing, always open to growth and decay.

There is a lack in this non-being that can be viewed as emptiness. Emptiness is like wind. Eventually, emptiness can be seen as a reality itself, like a Thing, similar to the way Bardon later talks about on The Great Here Now. Listening can help, too. Listening to the sounds around you and putting your attention on hearing rather than thinking, especially if one is in a quiet room. Quiet sounds are a quiet mind. I do a video here which may help.

Visualization: Some people find it easy and others struggle for years – what can you suggest to students to make this part of training go more smoothly and productive. 

Clint: I think one part of the confusion on this has to do with the way visualization is usually talked about in day to day speech. It’s talked about as if it’s not really true. One is just imagining it; it isn’t really happening. With Bardon, visualization is creation; it’s manifestation. It’s dreaming it into existence immediately. One does have to have a little bit of faith that Bardon is leading us in a way that works. If one wonders if the water really is getting impregnated, the visualization/manifestation looses it’s power. It’s an act of faith really. Here is a video I made on this subject.

Vital Force and Elements: What tips can you provide here?

Clint:  This was probably the biggest part of my Bardonian work. Once it got integrated, everything else came ten times easier. My way is to learn where the elements are located in the body, know that fire and light are on the right side, for right-handed people, and water and darkness are on the left side. Vertically, fire is in the head, air in the chest, water in the abdomen, and earth in the lower body. This is all in IIH, of course, but it’s important to actually feel it all and experience it in one’s body. Then it becomes one’s own. Once I began to experience the elements in me day-to-day, recalibrate them when disequilibriums happened, and get things balanced again, then I could plug into the Akasha seamlessly and travel to the astral plane at will.

As far as vital force, well, the physical and soul trainingin IIH definitely add to this. And certainly the breathing in of the elements. But there is also just physical fitness. If not martial arts, then a gym membership, weight training, or just doing squats and push-ups and home. Squats can definitely supercharge chi/qi. I talk more about the elements here.

Hand Gestures: Have you used these a lot in your training? If so how have they helped and if not what made you decide not to use them as a tool?

Clint: I have used them a good bit. They are good for anchoring certain states and procedures. It takes time, though, getting into the state, making the hand gesture, and repeating. But once integrated, the hand gesture can be a kind of shortcut to the state or process, or at least a strong aid. Getting the elements balanced and charged and then tuning into the Akasha is primary for me, so I have anchored this in a hand gesture. Now, I can get into a state of magical equilibrium and tuned into the Akasha with just this gesture. Anytime, I’m really charged with electromagnetism, I anchor that in a gesture. They say it takes 21 days to form a habit – that’s the research. And I would say it took me about 21 days to securely anchor those aforementioned hand gestures. Getting into the state, forming the association with conscious intent, then going about my day. Then, I did the same thing the next day, etc, until about at the 20 or 30 day mark it was firmly anchored.

Transference of Consciousness: A hugely important skill, what can you share about this and what advice would you give students at this point in their training.

Clint: When it comes to things like transferring consciousness to an object, I prefer to merge with the object. Everything is one, so why go from point A to point B if they’re already part of each other? Sure, a certain lack of attention gets paid to the physical, but I prefer to do this process gracefully. Anything that feels too abrupt or dislodging, I shy away from, and I would encourage the student to reevaluate. I suppose, in short, I see transference of consciousness as forms and types of attention, and like everything, it’s easiest to do with elemental equilibrium. I should also note that on the later steps, my own preference is not to separate the soul-body from the physical body. When I separate the two, to move an object, for example, I tend to get sick afterwards. It’s like it overthrows my immune system. Again, this exercise can be done smoothly, with good visualization and attention. I think some over-complicate it and make it harder than it has to be.

PAA: Is your path limited to Bardons books or do you also dabble in other methods?

Clint: I practice Christian mysticism and pray. For awhile, I was a student of the advaita Vedanta teacher Roger Castillo. Also, I really like Eckhart Tolle, Adyashanti, and Shunyamurti. I love Zen Buddhism and have gone to many Zen centers and temples. Zen has a way a cleaning things out and strengthening the will. The singer Leonard Cohen called Zen, the “spiritual marines.” I loved the books and talks of Alan Watts. Of course, at the monastery I went to, there was a lot of chanting of the liturgy, which had a really potent impact on me. The entire place was charged with celestial light. When I’d leave and then come back, it felt like the archangels were doing surgery on my soul. I’m really sensitive to the energy of places. Of course, Bardon is great, because he gives you the tools to impregnate places and shift the energy of places with bad vibes. I love the Christian mystics a lot, and I practice the Jesus Prayer which comes from Orthodox Christianity. The Jesus prayer is very powerful and sustaining. It gives me the option to admit my own limitations and call on divinity for mercy and protection. But right now, I try not to mix too many teachings with each other; it feels counterproductive. Bardon is primary these days. I don’t dabble in too many occult teachings. One thing I feel strongly about is that there is divine help and divine intervention that can take place with Bardonian work. I’ve received a lot of divine aid and feel certain that Bardon is helping me from the other side. I’ve worked a good bit as a psychic.

PAA: What have been your most challenging experiences in the practice of IIH, PME and KTQ. 

Clint: Making it my primary teaching to follow. Right now, it is. But for awhile it wasn’t. It’s also challenging knowing when to be silent about it and when to share about it.

PAA: What have been your most rewarding experiences in the practice of IIH, PME and KTQ. 

Clint: Happiness, joy, fun, gratitude in the work! I feel like this is too easy to forget. So many take Bardon so heavily. I feel like it’s ultimately fun, an act of play, a dance of happiness.

PAA: What are your thoughts on beings that magicians evoke? Are they simply evoking their own subconscious or are they evoking truly independent beings?

Clint: That’s a very good question, and an important one. I think it could be either. At the current point in time, I don’t have much interest in evoking spirits, one way or the other. If it’s more power I want, I can just use autosuggestion, impregnation, visualization, hand gestures, etc. Many things get transferred into all planes and spheres, without having to create an elementary or such.

PAA: You also work as Creative Director at Contemplative Light. Could you tell us more about Contemplative Light?

Clint: Sure. Contemplative Light was formed back in 2017, with three people, including myself. It has grown to a staff of writers, as well as many online classes with course offerings, usually in the Contemplative Christianity niche. Right now, we have a very active YouTube page that is growing rapidly. One of our videos on The Christian Mystics went viral! So that is exciting. One area I explored writing about and teaching about with Contemplative Light is Integral Theory. The integral theory of Ken Wilber really helps integrate the psychological and spiritual, though reading Wilber can feel a bit academic at times. I also host The Contemplative Light Podcast, which is available on all major platforms. It’s mainly an interview podcast where I interview spiritual teachers in the Contemplative Christian vein or the non-duality niche.

PAA: You have a growing YouTube channel where you speak about Franz Bardons Hermetics, can you share the channel and tell us what we can expect to see over the coming year on that channel? Any plans?

Clint: I plan on doing videos on all ten steps and more commentary on the steps. I plan, too, on trying different kinds of videos, video presentations and such. I plan on doing a lot in the coming year for the page. I also just started offering coaching sessions on Zoom. If anyone is interested, they can email me at thegraveyardcowboy at

PAA: Thanks Clint for taking part.

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Frater IAC
Frater IAC
7 months ago

I have participated in Clint’s Akashic transmission sessions and they are quite powerful. I do recommend them. For me, the Akashic energy purifies so that any residual imbalances can bubble up from the shadow into consciousness so they can be dealth with as part of the ascent. Clint is very good, and I also recommend his podcasts and have gotten a lot from his videos.

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